Ahead of the Legal Innovators California conference, June 11 and 12 in San Francisco, AL caught up with Adam Nguyen, CEO of contract review pioneer eBrevia, to talk about what he’s seeing in the market and why he’s excited about the landmark West Coast innovation event.
We explored a wide range of subjects, such as how it’s naïve to think a large, complex corporate that is tightly connected to a very particular segment of the economy, can just ‘flick an AI switch’ and get the results it wants. He stressed the need to carefully fit AI tools into existing workflows.
Nguyen also noted that he had seen – first hand – a new trend emerging: corporates using AI not just to reduce headcount across the core business, but in the legal and legal ops teams as well.
(When AL first explored the impact of genAI on jobs, back in early 2024, the main conclusion this site came to was that law firm jobs looked safe for now, for multiple ‘legal economics’ reasons – but inhouse had no such economic defence, and thus there likely would be some AI-driven cuts there. Now, it seems that is happening, albeit at a low level.)
He also mentioned that in some cases legal ops experts are hired and then ‘put themselves out of a job’, because they sorted out the issues a company may have and then the business no longer needed so many people working in that area.
One other key point he made was that although genAI can provide greater efficiencies, some companies – especially in these uncertain times due to macro-economic shocks – simply want to reduce payroll, (as that’s a fixed cost on their balance sheet). And if AI helps them to do that, including across legal, contract management and legal ops, then they will.
This also connected to using ALSPs, as they were ‘off the balance sheet’, and also the ALSP would be the one paying for any AI tech costs. This connected with Monday’s piece about outsourcing risk – see here.
Nguyen added that genAI tools are steadily making a real impact inhouse in part because lawyers’ earlier experiences with the older iterations of CLM offerings meant they were looking for better solutions. There has also been a degree of ‘top down’ change, with senior executives at a company demanding the inhouse team bring in genAI tools.
To watch the video inside the page, please press PLAY. Or you can go directly to the Artificial Lawyer TV Channel on YouTube here.
Summary of topics (not in order) –
Adoption of legal AI tools now to reduce headcount inhouse. This includes reduction of legal ops people. (And sometimes legal ops experts put themselves out of a job.)
There is a desire to reduce headcount.
Have you seen that? Yes.
Reduction where lawyers asked to move, or also cutting legal ops roles.
genAI succeeding now because CLMs of the past were difficult to use.
Also, ‘top down’ decisions from management that legal teams must use AI tools.
GenAI not need so much training, but still need to think a lot about how fit into the workflow.
Companies all have very different needs and profiles.
Naive to think can ‘just switch on AI’.
There is going to be friction. Have to work with the client. Can use eBrevia connect to link to other systems.
How NLP and LLM mesh together? They operate at same time. NLP better at some things.
Do inhouse have more budget for legal tech? No.
Also, moving work to ALSPs (which may be using AI) – as gets lawyers off payroll.
Push cost of work and also the software is that of the ALSPs.
Working with ALSPs also de-risks things, as they not need to implement things inhouse.
Lot of non-AI factors go into AI adoptions…..the tech is just 30% of this.
Yes – LLM it is just a ‘software machine’ (RT) and anyone can buy one.
Also, there is a lot about risk. Clients externalise risk to ALSPs and law firms, so no matter what happens with AI, risk externalisation will always be there.
Looking to Legal Innovators California, San Francisco, June 11 and 12- Adam says he is really looking to see the macro trends: how people are using AI, adoption and how this connects to the macroeconomy.
And that’s a good use of Legal Innovators California, which is all about both the real world picture now, and also the Big Picture of where we are all heading.
You can find more about eBrevia here.
Legal Innovators California Conference, San Francisco, June 11 + 12
If you’re interested in the cutting edge of legal AI and innovation – and where we are all heading – then come along to Legal Innovators California, in San Francisco, June 11 and 12, where speakers from the leading law firms, inhouse teams, and tech companies will be sharing their insights and experiences as to what is really happening and where we are all heading.
We already have an incredible roster of companies to hear from. This includes: Legora, Harvey, StructureFlow, Ivo, Flatiron Law Group, PointOne, Centari, eBrevia, Legatics, Knowable, Draftwise, newcode.AI, Riskaway, SimpleClosure and more.
See you all there!
More information and tickets here.
